Wanted

[nomrbddgs]

Since everyone is sooooo concerned about Fanconi, but no one wants to help me on an article, I'm removing myself from a lot of the talks. I find it very disconcerting that everyone on the list jumps on everyone new about the Fanconi syndrome, and everyone says, 'We need to educate' but not one person will step up to the plate and help in a real way with a story. Is it hurtful? Yes. Is it informative? Much more so. But not one person helped in any way. Someone once said, 'If you want to use this article, just send a PM to me', which I did, twice in fact and was ignored. I'm finding people are being very hypocritical by saying one thing and then not helping out in a real way.

[Patty]

It's a shame as you say - I think such an article would help those with afflicted dogs - I suppose you want somebody in USA but wouldn't someone from Scandinavia be forthcoming?
In our magazines here we often have articles from people overseas.

[Patty]

Sorry, I meant Canada where I said USA!!

[tanza]

Thank goodness, I never had a Fanconi dog… so I would not be of much help... and there are not that many on here that have Fanconi Affecteds... I am sure Arlene that is it very painful for them to talk about... you might want to think about maybe joining other discussion lists.. or even asking maybe the ones that might be on the Fanconi list (list for only people with affected dogs) to maybe help.

[nomrbddgs]

I put the question out because I wanted a person who wasn't a breeder. Not to knock breeders at all. But it puts a different spin on it when someone walks into a breed expecting something and getting so much different because they didn't know and the breeder didn't explain to them what it was or dropped them when the issue came up. There are actually more people on this list who fall into the lines that I wanted. Someone who fell through the cracks and into a ball of wax so to speak. It doesn't matter where they come from! This is a universal afflication of the dogs.

Just because I come from Canada means nothing. I've accepted stuff from people written from around the world. I've done columns on dock diving with a Basenji, judging articles from around the world, breeding articles, ringworm articles, etc. If it's related, it's important. So thank you Patty, if you even someone from overseas can help, that is my big concern. Helping!. I did ask a breeder Pat, twice, to use her report and have been ignored both times. I know she got and read the e-mail, so saying she didn't get it doesn't wash. We've all had some very painful experiences with things we didn't want to deal with or talk about after, but we do it because it might help one other person understand it. eg cancer, thyroid issues, hit by a car, etc. This is no different. I have a dog who had HOD, that I deal with everyday with special diet, now pills and x-rays and blood tests. This is something I would never, ever want a person to deal with. Be it a breeder or a pet person. It's painful dealing with it everyday wondering if today will be a good day or a bad day.

While neither you nor I have been through it Pat, others have. How would you feel to try to figure out why your dog is suddenly peeing on the floor, not knowing what to do, losing weight, with the vet not knowing what to do either? You and I have an advantage of being well versed in the Breed, but I'm sure we would miss things as well until after the fact. After they were diagnosed the little light would come on and we would say, 'Oh, that's why…..' I'm just very frustrated that I am trying to find someone to write something so important, in the light of a personal experience, to help others, including myself, understand what may or may not happen. And then it goes back to the same old thing. 'Oh, I don't want to write about it because then they know I have a Fanconi dog.' I'm sorry to rant, but it's a vicious circle. We want to educate. We, who have never had a Fanconi dog want to understand, but can't because we've never experienced it, but when I ask, everyone clams up! I'm not asking the person to print their name. It can be put in anonymous. I just thought it was important enough to share, not just with one or two people, but for everyone who is interested, to understand what you could go through with this affliction and why we are trying to get away from it. I'm not sure I could appreciate totally what someone who has a Fanconi dog goes through, and I would think others are also wondering what is the big deal? Yes, we know it's bad. But is it worse than a thyroid issue? A seizure issue? A cancer scare? and why? Is it because of the prognosis? The amount of pills you need to give? What type of time frame? WHAT? I think many of us have these questions and really, I don't know, unless I went through it myself, because so little is actually written about the whole process from a personal standpoint, what I would or could expect. I really am sorry, I'm just so frustrated that there is so much talk around it, but no one wants to really address it. If it was something good, like the DNA linkage test, you hear so much about it and how it is great progress!

I have put it out there to others whom I know have had Fanconi dogs and I always get the same response. 'Oh, but my dog didn't have it.. it was....' and again, here we go. Sorry, I'm just really frustrated because I have been after this for about a year now and have made absolutely no progress at all.

I'll withdraw the question and just continue to hope we get some decent info from a brave soul who isn't afraid to say, "This is what happened to me, don't let it happen to you."

[tanza]

Why would it be different from a breeder? Caring for a Fanconi dog is no different regardless of who you are?… And many that I know found out because they strip tested, not just having problems with them peeing/drink a lot

[khanis]

Arlene,

I am a breeder AND a basenji exhibitor/owner.
I am not sure why MY experiences would not be as valid as someone who has not bred.
In fact, mine are quite worse.
Have you ever had MULTIPLE dog owners call you to tell you their dog was Fanconi affected? It is a horrific phone call.
How about when tha 6th call was not a call itself, but a call requesting that you re-test all of your dogs in the research test to be checked before their final run.
And to find out that YOUR own boy, your most prized basenji EVER, has started spilling sugar?

This does not count because I am a breeder?
I'd offer to do it and include my dog owner's views [that were given to me for an article I was writing]…
but apparently I just don't count.
Phooey on that.

[nomrbddgs]

As a breeder, I don't believe we have the same way of relating things to others. I am probably wrong, but when I say to you, I'm giving Zina a CBC, but as a precaution we are giving her Dex, Tramadol, Pepcid and Carafrate and Cefelexin, you may understand far better what I am talking about than a pet person. I find as breeders, when talking to the general public we tend to forget they are not as well versed and we start on technical terms that most people would not understand. Like I said, I am not knocking breeders at all and if I can find a breeder who will relate to the general public better than I could, without forgetting to whom I am talking, then I am all for it!

And further, the peeing/drinking was just an example. Every dog has different symptoms with some that are the same. To take this further, while strip testing WAS the norm, I'm very interested in how many are now still strip testing now that they are relying on the DNA linkage test! If they found out about it by strip testing, was that before the Linkage test? Or after?

This is what I am trying to get at! There are so many questions-and no answers until something like this comes up! I'm not accusing, I'm not blaming, I'm looking for answers and I will say it again-No one wants to admit, "I have/had a Fanconi afflicted dog!" I don't care if you have had one or not, I am simply looking for answers that may help someone else! Is there an article out there I can use that relates to everyone and say, this is a checklist, this happened to me, etc.

Kathy, I will privately contact you again. So no phooey on that!

[tanza]

My point exactly Kathy…. and just because I have breed litters... I still consider myself a pet owner, period... there are many people that have bred one or maybe two litters, they don't consider themselves anything other then a pet owner...

I don't have any problem talking to the general public.. only because I consider myself part of the general public... now if in a conversation with breeders then it is different...

[nomrbddgs]

Wrong Pat, Since we all want to get nasty, I did go with the breeder person first. I've been shot down many times. So try again.

[khanis]

I did offer my article more than once to folks….
No one has ever used the article.

White I do agree that as a breeder, I visit the vet far more often than the average folk, I know what more meds are used for...
but this isn't just due to me being a breeder.
I have had fanconi-afflicteds.
I have had multiple blind dogs.
I have had a dog with Valley Fever.
I have had a dog that shattered a bone and needed surgery.
Then the normal stuff... kennel cough, giardia, etc.

I see my vet for precautionary stuff and meds if need be.
My vet has finally bred his first [amd maybe last] litter of labs.
He understands what we go through and isn't really interested in that crap any more.

I can be contacted through my website or on here.. though I will confess that I don't visit her as often as most folks.

[nomrbddgs]

I will apologize to everyone. There was a miscommunication and a message I did not get privately.

I will still say, that as breeders, we tend to start talking as breeders and not as the general public and will occassionally throw in words that people do not understand. In an article, I have no problem sending it back for clarification. And if a breeder with experience wants to do the article, then I am more that happy to. Especially as I have just had something related to me that I hadn't even though of from a breeders standpoint. So, I was in total error on the breeder thing. Again, my apologies, as I did not think ahead to the statement that was put to me privately and my apologies to Pat, Kathy, and the other breeders on the forum for thinking too rigidly.

10 Lashes with a Wet Noodle for me! I am terribly sorry.

Arlene

[khanis]

I think as a breeder, I go through hell and gone for my pups and dogs.
I brought them into this world, and will go to whatever lengths it takes to make sure they are well-cared for…
I could care less what others think of me for my choices of homes..
if I wouldn't trust someone to babysit the late Benny...
then they are NOT good enough to have one of my dogs.

There are dog owners, and many on here, that get their pups/dogs from folks that MANY of us would call puppy mills or backyard breeders.
Over the years, the responsible breeders have just said look for this check this out for yourself
It is our way of having the pup owner discover the not-so-good on their own... more of a we are not pointing fingers kind of way ot helping them out.

I know there are some folks that would rather you just tell them the bad...
but this way nothing can come back to bite us in the bum. We are here for the dogs. But, we gotta CYA!

I think this was just a big misunderstanding and its all good now :-)So I guess I can get out of my jammies and let the dogs run amuck inside instead of on/under/around the trampoline!

[tanza]

Well put Kathy… and I agree

and is that one of your new pups your Avatar?

[Patty]

nomrbddgs - would you like me to have your request put in our (Basenji Owners and Breeders) magazine? It's just possible that someone here might be prepared to write for you. We do have some European (as opposed to UK) members. I personally don't know of anyone who would do it, sorry! Have you tried Steve Gonto? - he spoke movingly of his own Fanconi affected bitch at our Health Seminar.

[sharronhurlbut]

Arlene, are you still on this site?

[nomrbddgs]

I did get a very good selection from Kathy. Thanks everyone for their input. Kathy has done an excellent job helping me and I truly appreciate everything she has done. She has also given me a few truly great articles. Thank you very much Kathy, I appreciate all the help you've given me.

Thanks you Patty, I would like that very much. As I said this is a worldwide affliction and I would like to keep the column going to see the many different reactions from the many different owners of Afflicted Basenjis. We all know some definitely do better than others.

Although I do have a health column, I'm definitely trying to find things that are related to Basenji's and their issues. So if anyone has ANY health stories they would like to relate I would love to be able to print them. Actually, any stories related to Basenji's specifically. I always send a copy of the newsletter to anyone who contributes to the newsletter. It doesn't even have to be health related. We have one going right now about an airline escapee. We have also had thyroid columns, racing columns, obedience columns, I would like to get one on hunting, and any other activity that is related. I specifically asked at this time about Fanconi because of the change last year in the cheek swab.

Sorry, I'm all over the place, but my brain is going in 100 directions. So thank you everyone, sorry for all my frustrations and short temper. As I said 10 lashes-sorry, give me 20. I've been a bear.

[sharronhurlbut]

Arlene, we are all here to help you.

[Patty]

nomrbddgs - Please send me details. Our magazine doesn't come out now until October so there's time - however, I could also ask the breed notes writer in the national weekly dog paper to make the request for you.

[snorky998]

As I re-read this thread I thought about being a 1st time 'senji pet owner and what it would have meant to me if my Tyler had been diagnosed with Fanconi.

It brought to mind the old Kubler-Ross model (1969)…..
Denial
Anger
Bargaining
Depression
Acceptance

Please, not to stir the pot, but I'm wondering..... when 1st time Basenji pet owners are confronted with the possibility of Fanconi in their beloved pup (you all remember the 'love at first sight' moment) don't they in fact go through something different than a breeder? I've seen it here at the forums; Denial and Anger surface first and usually in that order.

From my PPOV....we did the breed research for 5 years (online and with books), we knew about Fanconi. We contacted our Vet ahead of time to make sure she was willing to take on our Basenji and was aware of the genetic risks. We chose a pup from a breeder that was represented not only on line as reputable, but also was a co-breeder with an author from one of our books.

My second B. was researched in the same way. I LOVE them both.

Imagine then, after all that time and research you found and read this forum and you had an affected pup/dog.

Denial–-of course, the breeder misrepresented themselves.
Anger--again of course.
'F' all those BYB's and Mill people that have wonderful web sites that draw in the unassuming consumer.

It IS, IMHO, different for petowners