@betterrthings Is he a trindle?
New potential Basenji Owner in Wisconsin–-am a little scared!
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I just do rescue, so to me, informing folks of fanconis testing, when they didn't get their dog from a legit breeder is very important.
I am sorry it comes across as mean, but I think we want you to know what will be coming your way, and the fanconis test can help you. -
I do understand the challenges that the subject brings up, and by all means tell are there is to tell, does it have to be so negative and abrupt? I don't believe that I said nor meant that in any way should you give a dog up because it didn't meet "forum criteria" (and I mean that loosley so please refrain form quoting), by all means love that dog like any other, there might be hard times down the line, but the dog deserves all the love none the less. For instance. if I am looking at a dog and it might not be from the best of places, does it have to be compared to one of the mexican fast food chains spokesdogs? Unnecessary, right. I mean, for a lot of people, me included, it is very close to having your own child, I mean bringing a dog home…and the last thing you need is to hear that you not only probably chose a "bad" breeder, the dog also looks like a joke..
It might be hard to communicate the emotional context with text, but that hasn't stopped other threads from showing the happy emotion in text. Ok so I don't know how else to say it so I apologize if is doesn't make sense.
For next time, when/if I get a second B I will research breeders more then I did this last time. My main goal when I was looking for Otis was Fanconi clear and I got that. In every breed, regardless what type there will be illnesses, especially today when so many weird things are going into the feed and shots they have to have etc. I have had 2 dogs that within the last month and a half have past away form different ailments. One was a mutt, sweet Lou, nothing wrong until Now-2008, gained 20 lbs over one months time-severe hypothyroidsm, started getting really moody and violent-brain tumor behind a bulging left eye...and he was a mutt. My other dog, Bogus, a westie has had bad allergies all his life and eventually his kidneys and liver couldn't take the pressure anymore. My point is, all breeds/mixed or pure has issues, may have issues. If we as humans are taking them in, regardless of breed, we owe them the best life they can envision. We can not make peolpe understand the severity of certain ailments by being rude, in your face or whatever have you. Humans don't respond well to that, we are like Basenjis, we respond to positive reinforcement, not sugar coating the issues by all means , but nice, non attacking manners, that make people open up regarding things instead of shutting them out.Rita Jean, thank you, as a newbie here I feel you understand what I am trying to get out. Yes Otis has grown so much, at 4 1/2 months he is topping off at 20 lbs and about 15" in his shoulders, and I love how people react when they see him, he literally stops them in their tracks....handsome boy.
Petra -
I swear this issue comes up every 4-6 weeks and the bottom line is that no matter how someone on this list tries to put it, some people will feel any question about where their puppy is from or about health testing comes across as negative. If people are that sensitive about hearing, "If you don't mind sharing, where did you get your basenji?" or "Have you heard about the Fanconi test? Was your basenji or its parents tested?" then maybe it is their issue and not a problem with the question.
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Maybe…
I guess you shouldn't beat a dead horse?! -
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I can understand how that would hurt your feelings...but I don't think the reference was to the dogs looking like a joke. It was more in the way of commentary that there **may have been some accidental breedings that created a dog with more of a 'chihuahua' look; particularly since there are some unpredictable color/patterns being reported. I don't know, because honestly, I didn't follow the thread all that closely. I am pretty sure that nobody here would intentionally imply that one breeder's lines were a joke. -
My feelings are far from hurt. I couldn't care less regarding that particular statement, but I wonder how the person whom this thread was started by felt. After all she came for encouragement and got all that and some chips…
But since this issue will be coming around in 4-6 weeks I guess I'll just wait for the second helping...
If we just spent half of this threads timeframe on the health of the American people...wow, we could be in some serious business.Either way, hopefully Catherine has been listening in and is taking a deep breath before she joins us all on this wonderful, but crazy wild Basenji ride.
Petra
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Petra, I don't understand your statement …
you wrote
If we just spent half of this threads timeframe on the health of the American people...wow, we could be in some serious business.Do you think talking about b's health issues are overdone?
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Talking about health in our breed (or any other breed) can never be talked about enough… IMO
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Ok, yes, I do agree..I just wasn't sure if she thought we were doing TOO much talking re b health.
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No I don't think we are talking too much about the health…among ourselves. But if we scare new people away, people that have yet to learn all about the different health issues, what good does all the talk do, that was simply my point.
By all means I enjoy the knowledge and look forward to many years of B ownership and companionship. I want to learn as much as I can about the breed and about the problems that might arise. I also think most people need to hear it, but if they get turned off from the forum in their first visit or two, how do we then teach them? Do you think those people refrain from getting a B, or do you think they simply get one but won't visit the forum again?
Y'all must clearly think I am so stupid B--ch, asking if I think we are talking too much about the health issues. Do I own one of these dogs? Do I come on here and answers questions? Clearly I too, have a devotion to my breed.Petra
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I agree knowledge is good but I do not want people to never get a B cause we run them off they would miss so much by never getting a B. It's great to have one of these babies in the house but if I had read or found this forum before I got Jaycee I may a ran away and never looked back. Bad for Jaycee and most of all us we all would loose. Yes the testing needs to be done and so called people that breed and sell and never want to see you or the puppy again need to be gone but like a house that was never in code bad people every were. I just want people to stay on here and read but most of all to also enjoy fun and pictures they are great.
Is there not some kind of information sheet or something that could be put on here some were so when new people come on here they could just go read the information. Then it would not seem like people were all comming at you? Just wondering. Thanks…Rita Jean
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Here is one piece of the comments that I want to address: " and people will keep comming back and asking questions and taking care of there B's."
This list SHOULD NOT BE the place where you get your information about your basenji. Your breeder should be the first palce that you get your information and quilte honestly they should have the best information that is specific to his/her line. If anyone gets a dog from places where we know compliants have been filed, dogs have died from things that were basically preventable, where we know if you call with a question - you won't get a call back - we do get a little frustrated. We know then you are going to rely on us - from all over the country to give you information and we ask about lineage so we can search our records or memory banks on what we know about the background of your dogs.
Several of us (and keep in mind that I have not bred a basnji litter in 6 years - so not that I'm trying to sell something here) are just amazed that folks can not find those of us with information to share and an extensive knowledge base, when they are looking for a puppy - but always seem to find us when they have a problem with the puppy they get.
Some because they did not want to wait until the next breeding season because we all know that basenjis are typically in season 1 time a year (although I am hearing that some that folks have gotten dogs from recently - are using chemicals and hormones to induce a second season). appears that many decide they want a basenji now and that's that. They will go to whoever has puppies without doing the research. Many times people love that they can see a whole litter and pick - when most of us know that some basenjis should not be in some situations and try to place a puppy specifically to avoid future issues.
Believe me - most of us that have been doing this since the beginning of time have many things we could be doing rather than answer questions to help folks live and enjoy their basenji. We try to help people with questions and why we ask for the liniage is it helps us get to what the problem might be if it is something genetic or that we've seen from a particular line before.
Maybe when someone posts a hey we're new - we need to have and auto reply that says - if we ask about your puppy and where you got it - it is only to anticipate problems you may have.
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I don't think this last post is entirely fair. I was raised in an environment with no animals and many of my friends didn't own pets either. I came to have a strong dislike for dogs, due to the barking, slobbering, shedding, crotch sniffing, growling, jumping with dirty paws, nipping, doggie odor, bad breath, etc. - the only things I knew. I had no interest in learning about breeders, breeding, diseases - nothing to do with dogs. I did (and still do), however, have a fascination with ancient Eqypt & when I laid my eyes on the first basenji I had ever seen, I immediately fell in love - he was a little black fella who reminded me of Anubis. I could not have him though, because at the time, my husband & I were living in an apt. complex which did not allow pets. Three years later, I was still thinking about the little bugger when we moved into our 1st house. I had done extensive amounts of research on the breed, however, I did not consider researching any breeders. Why? Because I had no clue there was any distinction between accomplished breeders and puppy millers - I didn't even know what a puppy mill was! I had simply thought pet stores acquired their pets from breeders and THEY were the ones who were responsible for the horrid conditions & health problems. I know now this sounds completely ridiculous, but only because I've been educated. I still am not a dog lover, although I've become quite tolerable of other non-basenji breeds.
With that said, I ask questions & like to learn from everyone on this forum, not just the breeders. I am not relying on you or anyone on this forum for direction on how to raise & handle my Bs - just looking for people to share experiences & knowledge. If you are finding better things to do than answer questions on this forum, then by all means, do them! -
@Rita:
I agree knowledge is good but I do not want people to never get a B cause we run them off they would miss so much by never getting a B. It's great to have one of these babies in the house but if I had read or found this forum before I got Jaycee I may a ran away and never looked back. Bad for Jaycee and most of all us we all would loose. Yes the testing needs to be done and so called people that breed and sell and never want to see you or the puppy again need to be gone but like a house that was never in code bad people every were. I just want people to stay on here and read but most of all to also enjoy fun and pictures they are great.
Is there not some kind of information sheet or something that could be put on here some were so when new people come on here they could just go read the information. Then it would not seem like people were all comming at you? Just wondering. Thanks…Rita Jean
There are a number of "sticky's" on the forum that addresses information like how to find a responsible breeder, health testing, Fanconi, etc… noted by the posts when new people join us, they are typically skipped and never read.. so the next best thing is to ask the questions. IMO, sorry but the direct approach is best.... just ask and I think that most of us do so by saying "if you don't mind sharing" or who was/is your breeding if you don't mind tell us"... it is usually after that the question comes up at least about Fanconi testing.
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Clearly we all have very different opinions, and that is totally fine. No matter how much we hash this, it won't be "solved' or made better/different. I was merely trying as a new member of the pack to "let the older members of the same pack" see what I see ( and I don't think I am the only newbie on here seeing the same thing).
Petra
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it won't be "solved' or made better/different.
This discussion isn't new.. Every now and again it comes up when new members are 'overwhelmed' by all the goodness of the oldies here
But I have to say.. It is better now than it has been.. (but I'm a very positive thinker ;)) So the discussions weren't for nothing 
I think there has to be a balance between sharing info and scaring people off.. You can't be 'only nice' when people are asking things, or planning things, with which other people don't agree. (like breeding without health testing.. or buying a pup when it's clear the breeder isn't ok..)
Maybe the problem is, that everybody wants to say the same thing and it becomes a bit too much.. But that's a forum.. everybody is allowed to share it's opinion.. even if the one before him already said the same thing..
You should all visit the Dutch forums.. ggg.. we (cheeseheads) can be very direct.. so it's not always as nice and well said/written as it is here..
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I think this discussion is good. We all need to be able to post what we think to give others a chance to see a different side of any question.
I feel being direct when someone is planning on breeding an untested dog is best.
Does it mean they won't, nope, but I think we all have to try to educate those who are open to listening.
Just my 2c. -
In order to prevent duplicate discussions please seek out and point new members to existing threads instead of contributing to a duplicate thread. That way only issues that weren't previously discussed will be addressed and a lot frustrations can be avoided.
If there a thread that should be stikied, please email admin@basenjiforums.com.
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In order to prevent duplicate discussions please seek out and point new members to existing threads instead of contributing to a duplicate thread. That way only issues that weren't previously discussed will be addressed and a lot frustrations can be avoided.
If there a thread that should be stikied, please email admin@basenjiforums.com.
Alex, can you briefly cover how to link a prior thread in a post, so that everybody knows how to do that easily.
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This discussion isn't new.. Every now and again it comes up when new members are 'overwhelmed' by all the goodness of the oldies here
But I have to say.. It is better now than it has been.. (but I'm a very positive thinker ;)) So the discussions weren't for nothing I think there has to be a balance between sharing info and scaring people off.. You can't be 'only nice' when people are asking things, or planning things, with which other people don't agree. (like breeding without health testing.. or buying a pup when it's clear the breeder isn't ok..)
Maybe the problem is, that everybody wants to say the same thing and it becomes a bit too much.. But that's a forum.. everybody is allowed to share it's opinion.. even if the one before him already said the same thing..
You should all visit the Dutch forums.. ggg.. we (cheeseheads) can be very direct.. so it's not always as nice and well said/written as it is here..
I agree, especially with…well, everything above. But in a way, it is kind of good for this topic to come every now and again, because it helps people like me try to really think through how something is going to sound to a newbie, rather than just saying what I think.
People are never going to want to hear that they puppy they love (and rightfully so) wasn't exactly the bargain they had hoped for...but that doesn't mean we don't welcome everyone here. And it doesn't mean we should stop trying to educate people before they buy...for every one person that is sick of the message, there may be fifteen reading silently that are getting something from it.
I am truly sorry when someone's feelings are hurt about their beloved pet by something they read here...but if another person is helped by the post, that is important too.
