Is it just not possible to have Lenny around other dogs?

[Tayda_Lenny]

So I posted a few weeks ago about Lenny being aggressive at the dog park. Haven't returned to the dog park since, but I am going to visit a friend today in Cleveland and I'm bringing her dog from her parents house to her house. I picked up her dog last night (beagle mix, male, neutered) and brought him back to my place. Introduced them on neutral territory a ways away from my house. I had Lenny on leash and my boyfriend had Leo on leash. We started by just walking around independantly not even in sight of each other, and then slowly came together walking kind of parallel. The dogs seemed to not even notice each other except for the occasional glance and curiosity. This process took about 15 minutes and then when we were close enough for them to sniff each other, WHAM, Lenny stuck at Leos neck and drew blood.

We kept walking about 10 feet apart, and again, dogs not even looking at each other. Leo would not look at Lenny anymore and Lenny didn't seem to care, Lenny didn't even seem interested anymore. They just totally ignored each other.

We did the same thing w/ Tayda, and Leo and Tayda were fine. Sniff sniff… friends.

Brought Leo in the house and put him in his crate to keep him safe (not Tayda and Lennys crate, his OWN crate provided by my friends parents). Tried to have Lenny sit about 10 feet away from Leos crate. He turned into a madman. He acted like he wanted to kill Leo. Seriously kill. I've never heard sounds like that coming from him. He was in another world... couldn't hear us, just wanted to kill that dog.

Ugh... so I moved Leos crate to a different room and closed the door. He stayed in there all night, and didn't make a peep.

I don't know what to do about him... the weird thing is, the breeder takes him to shows and Lure Coursing all the time, and he does not act agressive or growl at other dogs at those venues... why does it seem like its only with me?

[Quercus]

It probably is only with you. You are is his very valued, and cherished resource, and he doesn't want to have any other dog (other than his own pack mate) near you.

He is still intact, right? This *might improve with neutering. For the most part, I would say this is pretty normal…but it *is alarming that he drew blood on the dog with no questions asked. It sounds like you did everything right when trying to introduce them.

Does he have to get along with non-pack dogs? I mean, is that really important to you as an owner? Personally, it is not important to me, as an owner. I want my dogs to be polite when they are near other dogs. I want them to be able to course with other dogs. But beyond that, I don't spend much time wishing they would be friendly to other dogs.

If it is really important to you, I recommend "Click to Calm" by Emma Parsons. Or "Feisty Fido" by Dr. Patricia McConnell. It will take a very structured training program, but you could probably improve his behavior quite a bit.

[Tayda_Lenny]

Hey Quercus, Thanks for the reply…

Yep, he's still intact. I have thought about the possiblity of neutering him, but part of the agreement with the Breeder is that she can show him, and I want to respect that... but yeah, as soon as he finishes his championship - they're coming off!! Unfortunately, its taking longer than initially expected, but she's really great with them, and shes got a pack of her own and I like that he gets to interact with them regularly.

I agree with you, Its not important to me that he want to play and love all dogs, but I do need him to be polite. I was really disturbed last night after he attacked Leo without warning. When we go for our walks and we pass other dogs, we let them sniff, and normally Lenny will start growling, I'll give him a firm 'no' and then we will continue walking. I never thought he'd attack. I told my friend about her dog getting bit, and she was not upset at all and had a very, "dogs will be dogs" attitude about it, but you never know when another owner will try to take action against your dog, or when their dog will attack back... thats what I'm worried about...

I'll check out those books. Thanks!

[tanza]

I agree with Andrea, male to male is always a challenge… even if the other dog is neutered (which by the way they have as do bitches a different smell about them).... one reason most breeders and rescue people always recommend boy/girl packs in the home...
Obviously his breeder has "control" over him that he is respectful at Shows and Lure Trials. Does he course by the way? Has he had problems at all on the field running with other males? And like Andrea... is there a reason that he needs to get along?...

[tanza]

When walking there is no real reason that he "has to stop and sniff"… Basenjis can be particularly agressive on lead... way more then if off lead... so I would prevent the situation of him growling at other dogs by not letting him stop and sniff. At shows very rarely will you see handlers, breeders, etc letting their dogs all go around sniffing other dogs... Most people at shows respect "your" space and the dogs stay confident that they do not have to try and defend the area. My take on the attack is that your dog makes "snap" decisions as in bite now, ask questions later... and I can tell you from experience that neutering will not make that much of a difference. And as far as breeding that is not a great trait to have... but again.. as long as they are respectful and polite in the "area"... I don't worry too much about "they have to all get along"....

[Tayda_Lenny]

He does course! In fact, he went to Chicago last weekend and beat his daddy in an event! She didnt mention anything about having aggression issues with him, but I did just send her an email explaining the situation and asking her if she has seen the aggression when he is with her. Maybe she just didn't mention it. Can't imagine she wouldnt have if it was severe.

A funny little story though, I guess he raced in multiple events and either he did really well, or he came in almost last… depending on if he could get over the muzzle being on his head. She said in 2 of the events, he just spent the whole time rubbing his face on the ground trying to get the muzzle off and came in last. And in a few others, after getting over the muzzle, he did really well, and even won one! ha.

About 2 months ago, I brought a male golden retriever into the house. Basically he was a lost dog that ran past my house looking lost and anxious, I lured him to me, had him scanned for a microchip and kept him here until the owners came to get him. I introduced them the same way as I introduced Leo to Lenny, outside, neutral territory. He was only but here for a few hours but actually Lenny go along fine with him....

[Tayda_Lenny]

that is - Lenny got along fine with him…

[tanza]

Well, it sounds like he just decideds what is an acceptable "other" dog…. my take and this is very normal for Basenjis... he has decided who he likes and who he doesn't.. Again, I never found it necessary to have to let everyone sniff everyone else especially on lead... and the fact that he courses with other males, tells me that he is a typical Basenji and leash aggressive... some positive training will help so that he is just as Andrea says "polite"...

[lvoss]

Another thing that could be happening is because you are telling him "No!" when he growls at another dog he is now skipping that step and escalating. If he growls instead of saying "No", back up to a distance where he stops. Each of my dogs have a different threshold of where they are comfortable with other dogs on leash. Nicky has been attacked several times in his lifetime and does not trust other dogs. He reacts much more strongly than my other dogs and needs more distance than the other dogs. For him going to training class where I can reward him for being near other dogs and being calm has helped. He still wants more distance than my girls but that distance has decreased and he has good manners. He also behaves differently at shows and lure coursing but he seems to know that is work and it is different.

[dash]

I am not sure if this is helpful or not but Dash is very leash aggressive and on top of that he chooses what dogs he likes at the parks and ones he doesn't. I can't figure out what exactly triggers his reaction but we have been becoming more concerned with him at the park. He is neutered though but I feel your pain.

[Tayda_Lenny]

Its funny how they choose to like some dogs and not others. Actually when Lenny was a puppy, like, 6 months old, my friend brought Leo over to play and Lenny immediately started growling. It was actually the first time I had heard him growl as a little pup. A few times after that we took all the dogs to the local tennis court to play off leash and they were fine together, but I guess he remembered him over a year later! So strange….

The sad thing about this is, that I like to take them with me where ever I go, if at all possible, but since Lenny tried to kill Leo, I had to leave them home this weekend with a friend. I just like to have them with me. I miss them now!

[jys1011]

We also have issues with BOTH of ours but one feeds off the other one. I noticed if he's calm then she will calm down. If he gets upset she goes crazy too & will redirect…to the point where she'll nip me on my leg OUCH :mad: but it's her nerves not that she's trying to attack me.

We're working with the Fiesty Fido book & there's a class lead by an animal behaviorist that's also based on Fiesty Fido book & we'll be starting that next week. I'm not too concerned with actually having them play with other dogs but to be polite on leash & with dogs that walk past our house window is all I want.

IF they for some reason can have ONE doggy friend it will be nice but I'm not asking for miracles here too

It's nice to know that there are plenty of Bs that share the same issues. I used to think that we just got some screwed up ones of the bunch lol

[Quercus]

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[tanza]

Oh my… be polite when other dogs are walking by windows...... now you are dreaming!!! gggg My house is like a mad house when people walk by with other dogs.... and I hate when they stop and point.. drives the B's totally wild (or should I say wilder)

[jys1011]

I feel your pain Pat..WILDER is the word!! Or maybe BANANAS…I'm like shoo dog shoo go away will ya!!

[tanza]

@jys1011:

I feel your pain Pat..WILDER is the word!! Or maybe BANANAS…I'm like shoo dog shoo go away will ya!!

Exactly!!!! I want to put up a not "stopping" sign!!!!