@senjisilly just now saw your reply. Thanks for the pedigree website. I knew about it and it’s a great resource.
Harmony Hounds in Georgia
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Mark,
I don't know where in Atlanta you are but have you considered looking in the Carolinas?
I really think you need to spend a lot of time being critical about where your puppy comes from. I have decided that for me, it is very important to ascertain the breeder's relationship (I guess that's the right word) to the practice of breeding. Why are they doing it? And how would you feel about getting your puppy from someone who gains financially from selling that puppy? I find that breeders have varying costs going into the breeding. Some may do progesterone test, others don't. One may do an AI because the perfect stud is across the country, but for another he's a 4 hour drive away.
The overwhelming majority do not make $$ doing but that's not why they're doing it. It's all about the intention going into it, for me anyway. And the only way of feeling that out is spending time with the breeder both on the phone and in person. All while trying not to get too wound up in the cuteness of the puppy in your lap (good luck)I am not too familiar with this breeder, but just trying to give some pointers for feeling out the situation yourself.
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I have viewed their website briefly. What jumps out at me is that they give nothing to go on as far your online research regarding the puppies. That makes me uncomfortable. Most breeders post the registered name of the dog, the AKC number or a direct link to the health tests on OFA.
And I think those prices are crazy overpriced.
When I search for kennel name "Harmony" on the Pedigree site, I see several dogs, but there's no way of knowing which are the parents.
When I search for Harmony on the OFA site, I get one dog: Harmony's Price of Egypt. His fanconi test was indeterminate between clear and carrier. If he's the stud, unless she used a bitch with a different kennel name for this breeding she bred an indeterminate to an unknown. Totally sketchy.
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I do not believe that any or very many of Harmony's dogs have Harmony as part of the name (could be wrong, but don't think so)… responsible breeders use it as part of the name so that the dog is immediately known where it came from... the rest of the breeders name dogs "whatever"... or the buyers name the dog "whatever".... They don't really care about that sort of thing. So makes it really difficult to search a data base for any dogs that might have come from them.
And Maui Girl is right on... you need to know your breeder, spending time, talking with them... learning about their dogs that they are breeding... are there temperament issuse or what kind of temperaments are the adults?... are there any "bite" issues with the teeth... do they know? do they keep records?... dogs with bad bites often have problems later in life and in 95% of the cases should should not be bred and are better of spayed/neutered
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Unless there are champs all the way up the lines, I can't see spending $1200 for a B. I looked at the website and she appears to me to be at best a BYB at worst, puppy mill. How can you invest "lots of TLC" into upwards of 15 pups and dogs at the same time?
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Thanks to all for the feedback, I will hold off on this opportunity.
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@AJs:
Unless there are champs all the way up the lines, I can't see spending $1200 for a B. I looked at the website and she appears to me to be at best a BYB at worst, puppy mill. How can you invest "lots of TLC" into upwards of 15 pups and dogs at the same time?
Even for all champions in the pedigree, $1200.00 is too high, IMO. In my litters there have been all champions for 4 to 5 generations or more, both conformation and performance, along with duel champions and I don't get that kind of money… and again in California (West Coast) prices are usually higher then the rest of the country as our cost of living is higher.
And I agree about the amount of time you can invest with that many dogs/breeds and then add puppies on top of it.
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Ms. Pat, when AJ crosses the rainbow bridge…hopefully many years from now, I will come knocking on your door for a non-show quality pet B.
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Yeah, I am pretty sure that most responsible breeders in the midwest and south aren't charging that kind of money for a well-bred puppy, regardless of show potential.
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Brat rescues Harmony Hounds failed placements regularly. I don't think she has a huge number of dogs but she sells at least three breeds. The most recent rescue I recall is a pup in NV who ate a portion of a towel in the first few days in his new home. His owners released him to the vet after spending several hundred dollars but being unable to afford the surgery necessary to save his life. I arranged his rescue thru BRAT in the nick of time and committed to pay for the surgery thru BRAT even if he had not survived. He was taken to surgery within 30 minutes of my call and did survive.
BRAT and reputable breeders provide basic instructions so basenji owners can avoid such tragic incidents.
Liz Newton, IL
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I agree with the above. It troubles me that she does not have the adult dogs' registered names/titles/health clearances anywhere on the website. Goodness knows I'm proud enough of my dogs to list that sort of stuff (er, if I had a breeder's website that is). It does make it hard to research the pedigree. The price seems awfully high too, even for the costal regions of the US. I know for her price, I could have paid for Zest (my most recently purchased basenji) AND several entry fees AND a hotel for a few nights AND dinner AND a bit of gas for the car.
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I was shocked at the prices to say the least, but yes, like somebody mentioned earlier, how can you possibly say that all your pups are socialized, when there are so many of them? If it sounds to good to be true…people, it is too good to be true..
Even if she doesn't show her animals and have titles to go with it, she should still do the testing and have her studs and bitches in the system..shoot for all that money, she can afford the whole gamut..shame..
and one more thing..with a nice website like that, why isn't she bragging about all the testing she is doing, instead of "health guaranteed"….because she is not doing the testing..
Liz, I remember when that pup came in, poor thing.. -
@AJs:
Ms. Pat, when AJ crosses the rainbow bridge…hopefully many years from now, I will come knocking on your door for a non-show quality pet B.
Ah… here is the thing to know about responsible breeders... we breed ususally for ourselves, to hopefully keep something to continue on with our breeding programs... Yes, I know it sounds selfish but that is what is usually going on... HOWEVER, that said... obviously we can't keep everything... so the next most important thing is placing a pup in a great home regardless if show or pet.. and for 80% of us, it is pet homes that we look to place them in... so in reality, I would say that 85% of pups that are placed by responsible breeders would be considered show quality and could finish their conformation championships. But that is not what a good breeder cares about and if they did, they would keep them all. If the home turns out to be interesting in showing or doing performance, that is just a bonus on top of a wonderful home. There are always exceptions to the normal... but just wanted to present what and how responsible breeders think....
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Brat rescues Harmony Hounds failed placements regularly. I don't think she has a huge number of dogs but she sells at least three breeds. The most recent rescue I recall is a pup in NV who ate a portion of a towel in the first few days in his new home. His owners released him to the vet after spending several hundred dollars but being unable to afford the surgery necessary to save his life. I arranged his rescue thru BRAT in the nick of time and committed to pay for the surgery thru BRAT even if he had not survived. He was taken to surgery within 30 minutes of my call and did survive.
BRAT and reputable breeders provide basic instructions so basenji owners can avoid such tragic incidents.
Liz Newton, IL
Thanks Liz, I figured that someone from BRAT would chime in if indeed there were pups coming through rescue from this breeder. I am curious, what was their excuse for not taking the pup back? I am not either defending or otherwise, just wondering if she was contacted about taking any of the pups back… and my only reason for that is that if you read the website she claims to sell on "limited" registration... not many BYB's do that
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Yeah, I am pretty sure that most responsible breeders in the midwest and south aren't charging that kind of money for a well-bred puppy, regardless of show potential.
I kind of like the term "show potential" puppy versus "show quality" puppy, it does not seem to suggest as much that the dog will necessarily do well showing and therefore somehow worth more in monetary value. I guess I'm technically a "show home" but I really consider myself a pet home…that just happens to have the hobby of showing my dog. And I definitely didn't pay $1200 to bring her home.
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IMHO, any breeder that I was thinking about that let their dogs end up in rescue instead of taking them back would be a breeder I would want to avoid. Add to it that the website doesn't list any health testing (I don't know a responsible breeder that doesn't list or link to their health testing). And $1200 is crazy high IMO, I didn't pay that last year when I got my pup from a responsible breeder that does full health testing. As well, my pup's breeder doesn't charge any different between show potential & pet pups.
I know you have been thinking about a pup since the summer, did you have no luck with any BCOA breeders. Maybe not in Georgia, but what about the Carolinas, Virginia, Florida. You might need to cast your net just a little wider.
I don't have my BCOA roster (has more people listed than what is on the BCOA website) handy, but when I get home this evening, I can list some breeders in surrounding states that you could contact and check with to see if they are having litters.
Also, did you check w/Robin @ Sherwood to see if she knew of any breeders having litters that might have a r/w pup. I will say that normally by now, the waiting lists are full, but you never know if there might be a cancellation.
