I'll just reiterate what Sharon said…. in this day of litigation, you're really leaving yourself wide open for trouble later on. Now that there is a test for this (and in the grand scope of things, its relatively inexpensive), there is no reason you should be passing Fanconi on to further generations.
Thousands of breeders & owners have undergone the tragedy of Fanconi without fully being able to predict or understand its transmission. Now that there is a test, it is the responsible, and HUMANE thing to do.
If you knew you had a genetic disease & you knew you could have a test to determine if you would pass it on to your human children, would you leave it to chance or get the test done to prevent possible years of suffering and financial strain?
not allowing me? Never mind no harm intended, i prefer to know about the puppies future
not allowing me? Never mind no harm intended, i prefer to know about the puppies future
Not trying to add fuel to a fire here but from what I have learned since being a part of this forum it is up to the breeder to decided what is best for the puppy; from what I have read on this post it seems that Thegriffswife is trying to learn and become a responsible breeder you have to respect her decision on whether or not one of her pups is suited for you and your situation. Bravo to thegriffswife for trying to do that.
Yes, I do agree that breeders do decide what is best for the puppies.
BUT quality breeders or anyone who had a litter for that matter, are responsible for the dogs they produce.
They SHOULD care about the long term health of the pups and be accountable.
I am taking about legally be responsible, as I have little doubt most people who have puppies do love them…BUT its more than that.
They are selling a product and in the country, if you get something defective and you COULD have prevented this from happening, you can be taken to task.
Rehoming puppies to the right home, that is another issue.
Having puppies and not having every test done that can/should be done, is what I am speaking of.
well i was finished with griping about this, as there was alot of details missing in this thread, i wanted a female, and we had spoke of a payment arrangment. i had replied asking about whether the pups were tested to which a response came saying that they were sold and that the males were still available. now because i posted a reply i was suddenly unsuitable? I was simply miffed because i had already let my son know that he was getting a red and white female puppy who he had named, and had a picture of. I truly believe that had we said we would take a male there would be no issue. (and i could post the note if it was really neccesary, ehich i dont believe it is.) nonetheless i decide to do some research here to see if they were tested or posted here, and in fact they were, and in fact they are not tested so we as a family decided to go with a safer choice with regards to health for all concererned so my son would not have to witness life a possibly sick animal. (irregardless of price.) I meant no ill intent or to start a tiff here but the truth of the matter is it was first come fisrt served, on some best buy puppies, with the outcome of thier lives being buyer beware. i have to say thank you to the entire basenji community for putting the information out there about the risks of faconi, which was what gave me a pasue in deciding to place my down payment.
I can only hope the new owners of these puppies learn about the fanconis test and do it.
Course, if they don't and they breed, well, guess that is where rescue comes in.
SIGH!
And may I add….BRAVO to swfseeks.., for not purchasing a pup that could turn out to be affected.
Glad that griffswife is going to test in the future. That in itself doesn't negate the fact that irresponsible breeding has already occurred, and there are untested bitches, studs, and pups in the gene pool.
Placement of pups is a HUGE factor in our breed. However, breeding pups just to be placed, is an abomination.
Hang in there swfseeks. A certified healthy pup is on the way to you if that's what you truly feel, and your house will be a forever home for one of these crazy 'kids'.
A final note, we are looking for a basenji puppy, color and sex now undetermined( we had chosen the name rosey for a female, but could revisit this process) which is faconi tested, for a family pet which comes to under 675 us shipping includued (as we are canadian) air shipping would be to detroit.
You might have to do some saving to make sure the funds are there for a responsible breeder, but once that is taken care of, you will not be sorry that you waited.
Dogs are our companions, I have heard of breeders who don't test say, we will take the dog back and give you another.
Heavens!!! this animal isn't a sweater from Nord's that you take back…we all fall in love with the dogs and want to keep them with us.
So, do let us know when you find your forever pup!
I sure will and thank you 
It is my hope that all those puppies are just fine too… Here to hoping anyways
Yes, I do agree that breeders do decide what is best for the puppies.
BUT quality breeders or anyone who had a litter for that matter, are responsible for the dogs they produce.
They SHOULD care about the long term health of the pups and be accountable.
I am taking about legally be responsible, as I have little doubt most people who have puppies do love them…BUT its more than that.
They are selling a product and in the country, if you get something defective and you COULD have prevented this from happening, you can be taken to task.
Rehoming puppies to the right home, that is another issue.
Having puppies and not having every test done that can/should be done, is what I am speaking of.
Sharon,
I totally agree with you and I think that thegriffswife is learning and will hopefully become a responsible breeder from everything that we all chat about. I help out with BRAT and know what happens when someone does not go to a responsible breeder and ends up getting in over their head.
As for SWF, I am sorry that your query into getting a basenji did not go so well and I hope that you will find the right little guy or girl for you with a breeder that you feel comfortable with, you are right that testing is very important and it should be done my statment was to support thegriffswife because I feel that she is new at this and is trying to set things right. I hope I am right. As I said, I did not want to add fuel to the fire but I didn't want to see her getting bashed if she is trying to learn to do the right thing.
Is there any chance there may be a B you could be interested in through BRAT? Good luck with your search.
Dogs are our companions, I have heard of breeders who don't test say, we will take the dog back and give you another.
Heavens!!! this animal isn't a sweater from Nord's that you take back…we all fall in love with the dogs and want to keep them with us.
That's a phrase I've never understood. Once I'm attached to my dog, I don't want a replacement!!! I agree with, its not a sweater you return because its defective. Its a living breathing unique individual with its own personality. Nothing could ever replace one of these guys.
Not trying to add fuel to a fire here but from what I have learned since being a part of this forum it is up to the breeder to decided what is best for the puppy; from what I have read on this post it seems that Thegriffswife is trying to learn and become a responsible breeder you have to respect her decision on whether or not one of her pups is suited for you and your situation. Bravo to thegriffswife for trying to do that.
That part is great… decided where to place the pups... NOT testing for Fanconi is NOT
That part is great… decided where to place the pups... NOT testing for Fanconi is NOT
I agree totally
I have a question on peoples opinion (legal if you are a lawyer) Given that most states have a puppy lemon law that requires you to replace OR reimburse up to the price of the puppy for any genetic disorder visible by 1 year. If there is a fanconi test and a puppy buyer purchased a puppy and later did the test and found out it was affected - I think that would be sufficient grounds to sue in small claims court to get your money refunded.
I will be interested to see the first test case - cause I bet there will be one.
Yes, but if you are refunded your money, would you have to return the dog? After all, in the eyes of the law, dogs are just property.
I think it depends on the state but the class action law suit that was filed several years ago in California against a breeder of labradors who continued to breed and place puppies from parents known to produce hip dysplasia without disclosuring this fact to the buyers was seeking the amount of full hip replacements for each of the diagnosed puppies. This was significantly more than the purchase price since they said each hip joint would run $2000 and most of the puppies needed both sides replaced.
I have a question on peoples opinion (legal if you are a lawyer) Given that most states have a puppy lemon law that requires you to replace OR reimburse up to the price of the puppy for any genetic disorder visible by 1 year. If there is a fanconi test and a puppy buyer purchased a puppy and later did the test and found out it was affected - I think that would be sufficient grounds to sue in small claims court to get your money refunded.
I will be interested to see the first test case - cause I bet there will be one.
I do wonder if it isn't part the responsibility of the puppy buyer.. What if the breeder tells the buyer that de parents aren't tested? Then the buyer takes that risk, right?
The breeder of the Labradors was lying (or holding back important informations), but what if a breeder is totally open about his not testing?
Actually since the puppy lemon law covers cost damages - one could argue that the vet fee's should be covered (but again only to the price of the dog is typically the court damages)so it would essentially be reimbursement for future vet bills.
Re knowing or not knowing on the part of the buyer - how many people in THIS list were told something that is clearly not right about fanconi testing or not testing - and believed it. It is human nature to develop a relationship with folks we talk to and then believe them. (and get really mad when someone points out something that is a significant concern) I think that it would be unreasonable for ALL buyers to know which information is fact and which information is not fact.
So much is dependent on what is in the contract or bill of sale - how to prove that someone asked and got the answer and bought anyway?
It'll be interesting when someone does do this to see how it plays out.
Hello,
We are looking for a red/white female. We live in Wisonsin around Green Bay and would love all the information you could give me in regards to your puppies once they are born. You can contact me at johnson8903@yahoo.com or 920-737-5319.
Thank you,
Monica Ditewig
