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Breeding my 2 year old Basenji

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  • katomanK
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  • DebraDownSouthD

    @katoman said in Breeding my 2 year old Basenji:

    @Nancy-Berry there is nothing that mentions genitalia, you might be confusing the work genetic -OMG this is hilarious.

    You maybe were not awake or fully in control of your faculties, so you might want to reread your own post

    There is no law requiring to neuter them, it's a choice, and I am pretty sure I live in America still. Just because I am not a vegan, and I choose to eat meat, or I don't smoke, (I have never smoked )...its my right not too nor because I decided to have 2 real human children and not cut my ba!!$ off, and you might be all of those who wags a finger at all that, that's your right to do as you please, without my comments as it is my right as well.<<

    "not cut my .... off" .... genitalia there, not genetic. LOL. Yes it is hilarious.

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  • N

    @DebraDownSouth I'm glad someone else knows what genitalia means! He said it....no getting around it!! And besides.....who cares if he does or doesn't cut his b...$ off? Not me! He's getting so angry, he can't even talk right!! That's bad for the blood pressure!!

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  • N

    @katoman Well woop dee doo! Your son was in the military! So was I ~ along with thousands of others! I'm glad he's helping with Pit Bulls...they are terriers but people forget that last word. And idiots make money off of fighting them which is disgusting!

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  • katomanK

    Now she mocks the military...

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  • DebraDownSouthD

    Says she was also in the military isn't mocking it. It was point out that your son being in the military has nothing to do with the topic, any more than her being in it. Nor does Trump have to do with it. Nor does your family jewels. Nor does calling people names. Nor does most of the other stuff. Are you capable at all of discussing dogs like a mentally stable adult without the abusive rants and stuff? Give it a try.

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  • katomanK
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  • DebraDownSouthD
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  • D

    @DebraDownSouth

    Having been a 'dog person' all my life I decided to get a dog after starting a family with my wife. Tried the local shelters but couldn't find a dog that I felt was 'right'.

    My first B came from a pet store, I knew nothing about Basenjis and the owner said they are great dogs, good with kids and very loyal etc, he came with an AKC pedigree. I figured he would be great as he had a pedigree.

    Many years later I found out by research he came from a puppy mill in Kansas. His health was problematic after the first two years, he was also prone to pancreatitis. At six years old he developed diabetes, with the constant testing, insulin and needles. It worked out around $2000 a year for five years until he passed at eleven, so around $10,000. Still, I didn't really care so much about the money as he was such a good dog. The constant care was hard, he needed monitoring almost 24/7 as he was a brittle diabetic and his sugar was hard to control. Many late nights staying up late and every morning was early to test him.

    He coped with it well although I know he did not like the injections sometimes, we got different size needles which helped and became experts at injections. Still, I would wish no dog to have to go through that.

    Our other two Basenjis we got from a reputable breeder, our oldest is ten in a few days and has been very healthy her whole life. She is showing elevated liver enzymes now on routine blood work but shows no other symptoms. Our youngest is three and is also very healthy.

    So, to me it seems insane to buy any basenji without full health testing and from a reputable breeder.

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  • DebraDownSouthD

    I am sorry about your first dog. Having had rescues with serious health issues, I understand the desire for getting the healthiest possible. Sometimes, even with the best of breeders (like our Samoyed), problems can be a firestorm of bad luck. But your chances are so much better with good breeders.

    Not sure if it will help, but I have used milk thistle for my liver for 14 yrs. The research on it is not strong, but it can't hurt. And it's not expensive. I put nothing in me without my liver doc's approval, btw.

    https://vcahospitals.com/know-your-pet/milk-thistle-or-silymarin (for pets)

    http://www.mayoclinic.org/drugs-supplements/milk-thistle/evidence/hrb-20059806 (for people)

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  • D

    Yes you can be unlucky with anything, but doing everything you can to ensure a healthy dog should be the top priority.

    My girl has had blood work every year just as routine after my firsts problems. She has no symptoms, we just caught it on the yearly two years ago she slightly elevated, last year she was more elevated.

    We first started just Nutramax denamarin, three months later it made no difference to her readings.

    We switched her to Dr Dobs detox diet and Nutramax denamarin, went back after three months and her levels went up!

    So now we have her on regular food, denamarin in the morning, milk thistle in the afternoon and twice daily 1000mg of fish oil.

    Due to go back in February and see if that works. If not we will probably have to ultrasound. All her other blood work is normal so that is a good thing.

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  • taylor.rene.gT

    When to consider breeding?

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    DebraDownSouthD
    @bigv said in When to consider breeding?: So Taylor.rene . A little bit about my findings over the last 30 years is that every person who breeds dogs calls them self a responsible breeder? "" Yes, and fortunately for about 20 year now, anyone who really wants to verify if the breeder is actually believable can do so. Some breeders have no problem with incest for the sake of a ribbon as (dogs aren't people )..It is all about titles not the betterment of the breed. Being involved with race horses..<< Gosh, where to begin. " Incest" is a morality terminology, applied as everything from just not parent/child and aunt or uncles/nieces and nephews....all the way to 2nd or even 3rd cousins. It has little to do with genetics, hence adopted children count, and everything to do with moral views. That said, the human race is far from universally avoiding what would be called close line breeding or even incest. Isolated communities ...either physically by geographic terrain or socially by groups such Ashkenazi Jews and Romani, have limited gene pools. Ashkenazi Jews, btw, joke we are all no further than 5th cousins, but it is nearly true. Dogs and animals have no such manmade morals. A common propensity for many mammals to not to mate with closely related animals has nothing to do with incest. In limited populations they will mate, and the problems that arise if it occurs too often are due to decreased gene, increased expression of harmful genes etc. In controlled breeding, line breeding, even close, can be used to find if there are harmful recessives, or bring out desired recessives. If you think it isn't done with livestock, including horses, you're mistaken. With knowledgeable breeders who keep up on genetics, it absolutely is for the betterment of the breed, not a ribbon... Yes I am not a fan of line breeding but it seems that every zoo in the world has a similar view as they are always swapping animals to improve the genes . ...<<<<< Again, absolutely nothing to do with incest. Zoo animals, even those of nonendangered species, have a serious issue with limited gene pools. The level of that limitation cannot be compared to most pet breeds. We aren't talking many thousands of individuals, or millions, but sometimes 100 or less. Stud books are kept, for example, on all the polar bears in zoos and the effort to keep the diversification as high as possible is serious. (I'll leave out my views on them being in zoos.) So sure, if dog breeders were faced with THAT level of limited gene pool, line breeding would probably be avoided as much as possible. However, that all ignores the fact that dogs in any breed are mostly related.. If you go back 10 or more generations, you find the same dogs heavily in most lines. Sometimes 2 dogs that aren't related 3 generations back may share more actual genes than a closely related dog who has a lot of breeding out of the line on one side. That's where knowledgeable breeders come in. Having studied dingos for the past 15 years I can say without dought a bitch won't mate with relative... They are similar to basenjis in many ways. ...<< That's nice that you've studied them. But researchers are making new discoveries based on actual observations and finding a lot of what they thought isn't true. With massive interbreeding with domestic dogs, the pure dingos are disappearing. I envy those of you able to see them. However researchers suspect they have ...>>During this a hitherto unknown form of the “pure” dingo was discovered (based on DNA and skull features): a white dog with orange spots on the fur. This variant was considered as a single mutation or the result of interbreeding with an isolated dingo population.<< So they don't rule it out. (I downloaded to read, over 100 pages but you might love it. I'll save for later! https://web.archive.org/details/http://www.invasiveanimals.com/downloads/Final-proceedings-with-cover.pdf ) And my boy does have a title that no other basenji has . He is the first and only basenji to be approved by the Victorian State Goverment to be authorised to hunt deer on private and public land within its borders. But to some this would make him unsuitable to breed with you figure?<<< First, while you have done an impressive job with you dogs, I am pretty sure that is a privilege given, not a "title," and I am 100% certain his being able to would have nothing to do with whether anyone deemed him not worthy of breeding to. With the right health checks, good conformation, etc, I would think a good plus...especially if the bitch owner wanted to possibly enhance hunting ability. It simply isn't enough.
  • AndrewA

    Using 2 studs with 1 bitch during breeding

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    DebraDownSouthD
    Seems like a question for Hutchinson. I know he does tons of implants, he may know about actual splits. Probably AKC does too. If I can remember I'll look or ask both.
  • A

    Breeding a basenji?

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    tanzaT
    @Kipawa: I think most people will agree that neutering a dog does not spoil their spirit or temperament. More often, spaying or neutering results in a more calm, balanced animal. I agree, but we have lots of people on the Forum from over the "pond" and they have most different ideas about spay/neuter, different culture, different ideas…. and that is their right.... sometimes we all will need to agree to disagree..
  • tanzaT

    More Breeding Plans

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    L
    Oh it begins….as the summer ends the breeding season starts.....good luck this year Pat... I hope everything goes nice and smooth...can't wait to hear what these two produce. :)
  • WBLW

    In-Breeding/Line Breeding

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    tanzaT
    @Quercus: <> Right...I wasn't sure if that was the litter that Sue was referring to? But I don't know of her doing any other brother/sister breeding. So yes, Ariel is a product of that breeding. The idea was to do a test breeding to see what genetically, if anything, might be brought out. By doing an inbreeding, you can 'expose' recessive genes, and see what you've actually got. You can also set (as in permanantly set) type...but, that wasn't the goal in Sue/Jeff's breeding. In this case, the two "best" "typey" puppies from this litter will most likely be bred on from, as long as they test out as genetically and physically healthy, they will most likely be out-crossed, to bring in different genes. Ariel's brother, George, is quite stunning, and is easily the best looking puppy in the litter. Ariel has a beautiful head, but is long in body, short in leg. Neither one is what we consider a "show dog" ;) And the litter's sire is quite handsome!.... the dam of the litter, while long in the back and short on leg (like it sounds Ariel is) has a great temperament... both are great to build on the future.... and breeding out from these pups will be great to build on too.... I am pretty sure that would be the breeding Sue was talking about, like you I don't know of any other brother/sister breeding she and Jeff has done.
  • S

    Interested in breeding

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    lvossL
    I got my first basenji about 8 1/2 years ago. I wanted a dog that I could try lure coursing and maybe agility with. I was not interested in showing but agreed to try a a match or two before making a final decision and getting him neutered. At first Nicky didn't really show much interest in lure coursing and I couldn't find any agility classes near me so I entered Nicky in a match. We had fun and I decided I would give showing a try. When Nicky turned about 20 months old he finally decided the lure looked like a whole lot of fun so we split our time between showing him and coursing him. Nicky finished his AKC and ASFA Field Championships fairly quickly and when he was about 2 1/2 years old we decided we wanted to get him a companion. When his breeder was a planning a litter with black and whites expected I told her that I wanted on the waiting list. Nicky was 3 years old when Rally joined the pack. Rally has always been an enthusiastic courser and had that elusive "show attitude" that Nicky lacked she became my first Champion. During this time I also became active in my local breed club and in rescue. I learned a lot about the history of the breed and about how many people get basenjis because they are attracted to its small size and "barklessness" without understanding about its intelligence, sense of humor, and ability to scream bloody murder when upset. It was a big decision to decide to breed Rally. Being a responsible breeder means being responsible for the pups you bring into this world for the rest of their lives and means breeding with the best interest of the breed at heart. I decided to co-breed a litter out of Rally with her breeder because I felt that Rally had a lot to offer the breed as a whole. She has a healthy pedigree that is not over-represented in the gene pool, she has a fabulous temperament that has charmed many a person, and she is a lovely example of a black and white basenji. It took a year of planning and some bumps in the road but in the end we had a nice litter of 4 pups. I am very proud of all my puppy owners for keeping their puppies active and participating in lure coursing with their dogs. We had really hoped for a black girl in Rally's first litter but she gave us a black boy and only red girls. So we started researching again and after nearly 2 years of planning we bred her to an Avongara. Please take time to read about the emergency c-section that we had to have when one of the pups was mispositioned. It was heartbreaking to lose one of the pups and so scary to think that we could have lost Rally. Breeding is a labor of love. There are so many things that can go wrong and so much screening to make sure the pups end up in homes that will cherish them forever and understand what it is to own a basenji. Basenjis are not for everyone and as much as I love the breed, I have seen many end up in homes that should never have had a basenji and some were homes that would be great for the right breed just not a basenji.