Willamette Valley Basenji Club - January 18, 2011 - Portland, Oregon

[Kipawa]

Wow… what a great show that is going to be!

As the owner of a neutered basenji, I think it is great that you are holding a class to showcase neutered and spayed basenjis. I may not be able to make it this year, but I wish everyone who enters the very best!

[pacificNWbasenji]

Fran, neutered & spayed basenjis are welcome in more AKC events than not. Lure Coursing, Rally, Obedience, Agility, everything except conformation judging really. Conformation shows are specifically for assessing breeding stock, and that is why altered dogs are not allowed to compete.

[tanza]

@pacificNWbasenji:

Fran, neutered & spayed basenjis are welcome in more AKC events than not. Lure Coursing, Rally, Obedience, Agility, everything except conformation judging really. Conformation shows are specifically for assessing breeding stock, and that is why altered dogs are not allowed to compete.

Which is really a shame and a backwards way of thinking. There is no reason that spay/neutered can not represent a breeding program of the sire and dam. And represent a breeders breeding program. If we in the US had conformation classes and titles for altered dogs/bitches I bet we would get more people that might be interested in showing.

[pacificNWbasenji]

@tanza:

Which is really a shame and a backwards way of thinking. There is no reason that spay/neutered can not represent a breeding program of the sire and dam. And represent a breeders breeding program. If we in the US had conformation classes and titles for altered dogs/bitches I bet we would get more people that might be interested in showing.

A breeder can easily include their altered progeny in other events to showcase the well rounded diversity of their breeding program by being able to title their dogs in different venues. I don't think it is a shame for a registry to have a program specifically designed to assess breeding stock, and require that the dogs actually be breedable. As I said before, conformation judging is the only event where spay/neutered dogs are excluded. That seems pretty fair to me. But, that's just my .02?

[krunzer]

Ohhh this sounds so fun, too bad I am too far away! All of the side classes would be a blast! And it would be a good learning tool, to see what a good 'tail set is' or good feet.

[pacificNWbasenji]

@krunzer:

Ohhh this sounds so fun, too bad I am too far away! All of the side classes would be a blast! And it would be a good learning tool, to see what a good 'tail set is' or good feet.

This is the first year our club is doing a special event like this. One of our members went to Australia last year to judge a specialty "down under" and this is something that they do regularly down there. The BCOA holds the Elements classes, and those have been very popular. I hope we have interest and participants because I think it is a great way to showcase your dogs strengths, and help spectators see the standard broken down piece by piece in a way.

[Kipawa]

@tanza:

Which is really a shame and a backwards way of thinking. There is no reason that spay/neutered can not represent a breeding program of the sire and dam. And represent a breeders breeding program. If we in the US had conformation classes and titles for altered dogs/bitches I bet we would get more people that might be interested in showing.

Great thought, Pat, about a spayed/neutered dog being able to represent the sire and dam. In a heartbeat I would promote Fopaws. I have had many people that meet Kipawa tell me how good natured he is. Every time we are at a park, and I mean EVERY TIME, at least one person tells me that their dog does not like to play with other dogs, yet their dog is playing with Kipawa. I can tell they are so happy that their dog is finally enjoying the company of another dog. When I watch this happen, I can see that Kipawa plays and acts differently around these shy dogs. It's really heartwarming to see and further tells me that picking a good breeder with a solid breeding program is so important. I am thankful daily that Therese and Kevin found us to be a good home for one of their kids.

[eeeefarm]

@pacificNWbasenji:

I don't think it is a shame for a registry to have a program specifically designed to assess breeding stock, and require that the dogs actually be breedable. As I said before, conformation judging is the only event where spay/neutered dogs are excluded. That seems pretty fair to me. But, that's just my .02?

I had the same issue when I was showing my bitch (who finished her Canadian championship), because her breeder wanted her to compete, but I had no interest in breeding her and from my point of view it would have been nice to be able to spay her and still show her. I had that discussion with someone who used the same argument "she should be breedable", which to me was irrelevant, because it was just not going to happen, unless by accident (in which case purebred pups would have been unlikely!) Too bad, because I might have shown her more if I could have continued with her after a spay. The trials of having a short haired breed!

[tanza]

@pacificNWbasenji:

Pat, I believe spay/neutered dogs can be used as get in stud dog/brood bitch classes. A breeder can easily include their altered progeny in other events to showcase the well rounded diversity of their breeding program by being able to title their dogs in different venues. I don't think it is a shame for a registry to have a program specifically designed to assess breeding stock, and require that the dogs actually be breedable. As I said before, conformation judging is the only event where spay/neutered dogs are excluded. That seems pretty fair to me. But, that's just my .02?

I totally disagree and the use of stud dog/brood bitch classes are IMO, pretty useless. I have placed many a Basenji that could have easily finished their championship, however the family didn't want an in-tact animal… but would have shown if spay/neuter was available. IMO, there should be separate classes and awards for spay/neuter. The only place that you can show spay/neuter in the classes is at an independent specialty where there is no competition past Best of Breed. And why should a breeder be able to show case the breeding that they spent many hours deciding on the best cross possible to improve the breed with good conformation along with other performance titles?

Why is a spay/neutered dog not a representive of breeding stock? In my book, it most certainly is, while you might not breed that particular dog, the sire and dam it represents is the breeding stock

[pacificNWbasenji]

Now that our opinions have been established I would like to ask our readers to keep the replies directed towards the original post, and welcome others to start a new thread if they wish to discuss the other items that have been brought up in the replies.

[lvoss]

Just for anyone who wants to know, spayed and neutered animals are not eligible to represent their dam and/or sire in the stud dog and brood bitch classes. The get must be entered in the classes offered at the show and the ONLY classes that AKC allows spayed and neutered animals is Veterans and only at stand alone specialties where BOB will not compete further.

[pacificNWbasenji]

Thank you for clarifying that for me Lisa