For Sale: Basenji pups For Sale in Nampa ID
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Taking down anything Ive ever said.
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Once your around a bit longer, you will be able to see why this thread is so provoking for some of us. Doing rescue, its awful to me that this is breeding is going on.
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I'm beginning to shut up more because the basenji people on this forum tend to tear you apart….OVER EVERYTHING...... its really a turn off for us younger basenji lovers.... the older, wiser tend to be rude, off putting, and down right snobby. Never in my life have I seen so many people start
I know there is a need to educate and correct, but it doesnt have to be done in such an attacking manner….
Of course, there are a few nice ones :)So you look at the age of people to determine where they fit?
I am not even going to respond except to point out one obvious issue… your last sentence ... you don't take your own advice. Oh wait, if you are YOUNG, then whatever spews forth is professional education. Got it. -
Well…. this is the holiday season, lol. Debra, I don't know if Benda meant "old" as in the age of the people on here, or if she meant old as "those who have been on this forum the longest".
I understood her comment to mean those who have been here the longest, and I agree with her sentiments. Sometimes, it seems like there is a group of people who rally around, with a pack-like attitude, of criticising and judging others. It bothers me, and I, too, hesitate to post anymore. You may notice that my posting of CL rescues has been "minimized", since I was publicly flogged for starting these threads.
While I did have the best intentions in my heart, my actions were miscontrued as if I was promoting for a profit. I explained why in that thread, so I won't re-hash it, but suffice it to say, if the motivation behind that attack was to stop me from reaching out, well, it worked.
Not everyone on this forum has to agree with each other, but I believe there should be mutual respect and politeness for all. We can, respectfully, agree to disagree.... or as Robyn has on her signature, understand there are many different shades of gray.
:) Cheers, and Peace to All! :)
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Once your around a bit longer, you will be able to see why this thread is so provoking for some of us. Doing rescue, its awful to me that this is breeding is going on.
And I do agree with you Sharron
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We can, respectfully, agree to disagree…. or as Robyn has on her signature, understand there are many different shades of gray.
Yay someone read my signature and understood what it means! :)
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Taking down anything Ive ever said.
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Taking down anything Ive ever said.
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Taking down anything Ive ever said.
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Taking down anything Ive ever said.
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this is exactly what Im talking about. …. being downright xxx.
YES! Like this was!!:
the basenji people on this forum tend to tear you apart….OVER EVERYTHING
the older, wiser tend to be rude, off putting, and down right snobby.
Never in my life have I seen so many people start $h!t just for the sake of starting $h!t
Reaaly makes the people on here look professional and welcoming...NOT.
done in such an attacking manner....Okay let me try again, whether you meant old as age or old as time on forum, your post was as mean and snarky as those you seem to be against. You took no effort to write a constructive non-attacking post. Until you do so yourself, the hypocrisy of your post clouds any weight to it, making it obvious that in your opinion, YOU can post however harshly and snarkily as you want and it is educational. If someone else does, it is nasty. You can't have it both ways. So how about you posting in the way you think OTHERS should and set an example. Because to me, your post exemplified what you were ranting against. In fact, to me your post was WORSE than most. Most posts are about TOPICS, and however hotly debated, are not personal attacks. Your post, undeniably, was personal against people.
Another thought is that just because many agree about something, it doesn't make them some rabid pack. This thread is a great example. There are legit reasons that breeders and rescues have issues with what is being done.
As for the CL listing, I am sorry that Patty let them stop her. Unless the forum moderator contacts her, she should do what she wants. Even there, many of us supported her. It was basically a division between breeders/nonbreeders. However, both sides have legit concerns. Topics like that should be addressed by the moderator since it wasn't BREED related by forum policy related, imo. Patty, I hope you take the supporters of you, those who understand and appreciate your intent, more to heart than the others. (((hugs)))
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What has upset me the most though, is the posts that are downright mean, such as about CL ads.
I suspect many of us are jaded. We have learned over and over that if someone has the saavy to find Craigslist, they also could find the breeder, BRAT, etc. But you are right, we should be less reactive. But honestly, when someone wants to rehome a sick geriatric dog, I just don't know it's in me to think of any kindly reaction.
FYI, I had my name at our local shelter, volunteering for FREE (you get this FREE) training help when people say they are giving up their dog over behavior issues. In 15 yrs, I have had precisely one call. One. The shelter says when they offer help, they get hemming, hawing and a myriad of excuses. Bottom line, they want rid of the dog fast. I will try to be less jaded.
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YES! Like this was!!:
Okay let me try again, whether you meant old as age or old as time on forum, your post was as mean and snarky as those you seem to be against. You took no effort to write a constructive non-attacking post. Until you do so yourself, the hypocrisy of your post clouds any weight to it, making it obvious that in your opinion, YOU can post however harshly and snarkily as you want and it is educational. If someone else does, it is nasty. You can't have it both ways. So how about you posting in the way you think OTHERS should and set an example. Because to me, your post exemplified what you were ranting against. In fact, to me your post was WORSE than most. Most posts are about TOPICS, and however hotly debated, are not personal attacks. Your post, undeniably, was personal against people.
Another thought is that just because many agree about something, it doesn't make them some rabid pack. This thread is a great example. There are legit reasons that breeders and rescues have issues with what is being done.
As for the CL listing, I am sorry that Patty let them stop her. Unless the forum moderator contacts her, she should do what she wants. Even there, many of us supported her. It was basically a division between breeders/nonbreeders. However, both sides have legit concerns. Topics like that should be addressed by the moderator since it wasn't BREED related by forum policy related, imo. Patty, I hope you take the supporters of you, those who understand and appreciate your intent, more to heart than the others. (((hugs)))
After a while, it seems as its best to fight fire with fire.
Im sure everyone here thinks Ima big weenie and should grow up , but I just dont see the point in some of the forum contributers being so "snarky"
I too didnt agree with the posts about the CL listings, as I personally contacted the ad owners and offered my help in rehoming their dogs on behalf of BRAT.
Patty- you can email them to me if you feel the need to. With all the other websites I cruise, CL sometimes is the bottom of my list. Thanks for your hard work :)
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After a while, it seems as its best to fight fire with fire.
Im sure everyone here thinks Ima big weenie and should grow up , but I just dont see the point in some of the forum contributers being so "snarky"
I too didnt agree with the posts about the CL listings, as I personally contacted the ad owners and offered my help in rehoming their dogs on behalf of BRAT.
Patty- you can email them to me if you feel the need to. With all the other websites I cruise, CL sometimes is the bottom of my list. Thanks for your hard work :)
Poster child here for fire with fire, but I don't lecture about fire when using it. That said, lol, you see how well it works for me… don't go there :) Shame us snarkers by not being snarky.
I usually don't see posts as snarky. Perhaps because I have a tougher skin, perhaps because I have been on forums that make this look like an afternoon swim with the dolphins, perhaps because I try to look at precisely what is SAID and not tone when I can. But we can agree not being nasty or personal should be the norm.
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Poster child here for fire with fire, but I don't lecture about fire when using it. That said, lol, you see how well it works for me… don't go there :) Shame us snarkers by not being snarky.
I usually don't see posts as snarky. Perhaps because I have a tougher skin, perhaps because I have been on forums that make this look like an afternoon swim with the dolphins, perhaps because I try to look at precisely what is SAID and not tone when I can. But we can agree not being nasty or personal should be the norm.
I will try to look at content instead of tone from now on. maybe Im just too sensitive. I of course, would prefer a perfect world where everyone gets along….. sigh....
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Interesting that this posting is about Avuvis - I understood from Manou who I believe is an acknowledged expert on Avuvis that they were not Basenjis but very different and distinct breed.
She came over to Crufts one year and stood beside me near the Basenji ringside discussing the two breeds and categorically stated that Avuvis are different from Basenjis.
I am now confused and perhaps somebody could enlighten me as we don't have Avuvis in the UK.
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The senior b was just one to pop in my mind. Isn't it better for someone to try to rehome their dog on CL than to take the dog to a shelter or euthanize it? Why is it acceptable for breeders to rehome their older dogs after they are finished using them in their breeding program but it's not acceptable for someone to rehome their pet? I don't understand the reasoning.
I know of no responsible breeder trying to place a sick geriatric dog. And we'll have to disagree… I think better to hold this dog while euthanizing than place in rescue. Of course, BEST, is to be humane and keep this dog safe til it dies. :(
As for breeders, let me try to explain since I am not a basenji breeder and not in the fray. When you breed, hopefully you are dedicated to improving the breed. This is even more important with a breed with limited numbers. Ideally, I really think you should not have to breed a bitch more than twice to get something that is BETTER than the bitch. Ideally, after 2 or 3 litters, you have something that you move on to, retiring the dam from producing. Regardless of when, people have limited space. To me, taking a dog you are no longer using in a breeding program and finding it a great pet home where it can get the most one-on-one attention not only allows a breeder to have the space and ability to continue breeding, but it is the best possible thing for that dog. Breeders aren't breeding pets to sell puppies, they are dedicated to breeding to advance the breed. Mentally it really is a different place than just pet homes.
Both as a rescuer and a breeder, I rarely think my home is the only or best home. There have been precisely 2 exceptions... Sayblee and the Chow/coyote. Few homes would have been good for either. My back-up homes should something happen to me folks prayed for my health nightly til both were gone. Not another dog I have owned could not have thrived happily and maybe better in another home.
I know several breeders who are not able to breed every year, sometimes only every 3 yrs, due to lack of homes for their rare breed dogs because they refuse to have more dogs in their home than they can give pet-loving quality care to. I know others who simply start crating and packing in the numbers in the belief that the welfare of their dogs come second to their idea that they are producing something so wonderful with that next litter that the welfare of older dogs is 2nd. I'll leave out my views on that but am sure you can guess.
But that belief in there being a maximum number you can personally care for as loved pets as opposed to livestock, well it is a boon because it has kept me from keeping dogs I bred, that did not fit my breeding goals but wanted to keep, and dogs I fostered when I was at my limit. :)
So, I applaud those breeders who get those dogs into loving pet homes. It really is a good thing and it really is not related to someone dumping a pet because it is no longer convenient.
And that is not to say there aren't legit reasons to rehome! Heck, we just helped a lady who had to move, could not take the dogs, and she contacted BRAT. She didn't dump in shelter or sell to highest bidder, she did the right thing. I have a friend who placed her 2 basenji when her husband died. Her job was on the road most of the week and keeping them would have been horrible on them. She cried buckets, but she placed them… losing both her husband and beloved dogs. So if I have ever sounded like I don't think there is a time and place, there is.
OH, yeah and I placed a cat rescue once. My husband brought it home. I called it "the lump." Don't ask, suffice to say the thought of living with "the lump" for 18 yrs had me in tears. I found it a home where it would be loved, not resented.
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Interesting that this posting is about Avuvis - I understood from Manou who I believe is an acknowledged expert on Avuvis that they were not Basenjis but very different and distinct breed.
You are right that term Avuvi is used to describe a breed of African dog that is separate from Basenjis. There are several people including Manu that have Avuvi dogs and do not claim that these dogs are Basenjis but are a related breed with some similar traits but some distinct differences. Then there is a group of people in the US that imported dogs that they at first termed Avuvis and at first did not claim they were basenjis though they did not claim they were not basenjis. Later an organized import effort was made and the importers decided that they would like to see recognition of their "avuvis" as basenjis.
There is still much controversy in the basenji community about whether these dogs are their own distinct breed or if they are basenjis. As of right now, none have been put through the approval process outlined by BCOA and approved by AKC to be recognized as basenjis.
