Alone training

[tanza]

Have you talked to his breeder?

[NerdyDogOwner]

@tanza:

Have you talked to his breeder?

No. Never crossed my mind. Why would I do that?

[-ClarEmmKai-]

We know how you feel! Our boy has major separation anxiety that he cries being in his crate in the car about an arm's-length away (MAJOR work in progress!). Like the others in previous posts, he does stop crying after a few minutes and starts again as soon as he hears the key through the door. Fortunately we have family that looks after him when needed. And if there's none, we do leave him at home, alone, in his crate. It's been going well as long as he gets his long walk before, to empty and tire him out at the same time. However in the months when my mom's visiting and she's at home, we absolutely cannot leave him in the crate if we need to go somewhere where dogs are not allowed. He goes nuts when he knows there's people around and he's in his crate. Also known as nonstop crying/whining and destructive chewing.

We do admit however that we screwed up the crating part, which isn't AS bad.. could be worse. And we're still working on it and hoping that he'll one day realize that it isn't so bad. crosses fingers He goes to his crate when we're home as long as it's not shut, when asked or even voluntarily. He doesn't chew on an already chewed up blanky we leave in his crate. He's been eating the treats we leave in there too, unlike before where he totally ignores it. He even destroyed his kongs (2) and not even eat the treats in it. He's improving, we know we just gotta be REALLY patient.

I've always felt that it's the confinement that he can't stand and that if we were to leave him alone, not crated he'll be fine. But that's just me.. my boyfriend does not think that at all. He thinks that we'll go home with chewed up furniture, if we were to even try that.. and I don't have the courage to test it yet. I have tried it in short increments of say maybe 5-10 minutes while doing laundry and he's waiting by the door when I get back.

I agree with Tanza, get some feedback from your breeder. It should help you in one way or another. Talking to Arlene (our breeder) about this issue we have with Kairoe made us realize that we did screw up on the crate training.. and it made it worse because maybe Kairoe was like his mom who does not like the crate either. Of course it's not as bad as how our boy dislikes it, but we've seen how she is in it.

[NerdyDogOwner]

He doesn't hate his crate. He goes in on his own, and sleeps happily in it. Even if I close him in while I am at home he will accept it. As long as he can see me. If I turn a corner, he will start whining.

I have been thinking of getting a different crate. One of them "airplane" crates with plastic walls, so he doesn't have the chance of getting his jaw stuck like he is doing in this wire one. And perhaps larger, although a larger crate would look awful and dominate in my apartment.

Anyways, after sleeping on it. I have decided to buy some duct-tape and tape up the smaller spaces between the bars on the babygate, the parts that he gets his jaw stuck between.
As well as upping the floor heat in his room, while keeping the rest of the house "colder". Perhaps his built in Basenji heat seeker will direct him to staying in there, and he might enjoy it more.

I'll send an email to my breeder today and see if she has anything helpful to say.

[Janneke]

Tillo really hates.. or hated.. to be left alone.. That's why we bring him to doggy daycare or to my mom when we go out.. A couple of weeks ago we left him and Lycia alone twice for about 30 to 60 minutes and I got it on camera….. Tillo didn't do anything.. Lycia kept walking around, but Tillo was sleeping.. Don't know what happened there.. Maybe it was because of Lycia? That he's not really alone anymore?
I don't know why I'm telling you this.. but maybe it gives a bit of hope?

I also wonder how tired Gizmo is before you leave him? We are about to leave Lycia and Tillo alone for maybe 30 minutes.. but we just walked them for two hours.. So we just know they are tired..

[AJs Human]

I would only caution you regarding the duct tape: If Gizmo chews the tape and swallows it, he can develop some fairly severe intestinal complications. The strings in duct tape are not digested and may not pass through the digestive tract easily. They can become bound up in his intestine and cause an obstruction.

Regarding the separation anxiety and other behavior problems you are having, I am out of ideas. I would suggest you speak with the breeder and perhaps return him to them for a brief stay to see whether they can straighten him out.

[NerdyDogOwner]

@Janneke:

I also wonder how tired Gizmo is before you leave him? We are about to leave Lycia and Tillo alone for maybe 30 minutes.. but we just walked them for two hours.. So we just know they are tired..

I have had him completely worn out several times, usually after a dogpark visit. But he will remain in "panic" mode no matter how tired he is. He will fall almost instantly to sleep the moment I walk in the door, but not before he gets to lie down near me.

@AJs:

I would only caution you regarding the duct tape: If Gizmo chews the tape and swallows it, he can develop some fairly severe intestinal complications. The strings in duct tape are not digested and may not pass through the digestive tract easily. They can become bound up in his intestine and cause an obstruction.

Good call. I will use duct tape and then take some clear packaging tape over that just to be safe.
But anyways, I don't ever leave him alone in his room with only the babygate as a "door" when leaving the appartment. He can (and will) jump/climb over it at all costs (as you have seen).
I close the normal door when I leave him. The door closes on the inside of his room, so the babygate is on the opposite side of the door away from him and chewing risks.

I only have it open with the babygate when I am home.

@AJs:

Regarding the separation anxiety and other behavior problems you are having, I am out of ideas. I would suggest you speak with the breeder and perhaps return him to them for a brief stay to see whether they can straighten him out.

To be honest, I really don't want to send him to his breeder as a solution. She is "old school" and uses negative enforcement, such as slapping his nose. At least that was her "tip" to me on how to prevent unwanted behavior when I first got him…so that leads me to believe she just might slap him to get him to shut up. Something I don't want to put him through.

[Basenjimamma]

I feel for you..I wish I had any ideas, but I am all out. The heat in the room, making it cozy sounds good, the plastic crate might be a good one too, some dogs prefer those others prefer the wire ones.
Otis has bit his wire crate bars together so instead of being rectangular they now look like 8's..terrible, but I don't know what to do.
He does not like our plastic crate, I think he wants to see out..
. Do you have a friend or somebody you know that has one that you could try, instead of buying one and then it doesn't work out?
Do you have blocket or ebay for local sales in Norway? Buy a used one, that way you save some money..they can be really expensive, especially if they don't work and you are stuck with yet one more big thing that isn't in use..

Good luck, keep us posted..

[-ClarEmmKai-]

I like your idea of keeping the heat up in his room, I think that'll help seeing as they do enjoy warmth. Trying the plastic crate may help, less opportunity to see outside of it! I admire the fact that you refuse to send him back to his breeder.. that wouldn't help him at all it seems.

Well, good luck! I hope your new strategies will help. If not, have you considered getting another one to keep him company?? And quite possibly tire each other out!?

[Patty]

It sounds to me that all this has become a habit but I know you can't turn back the clock to the first time you had him.

Having just read through the posts I feel fior you dreadfully.

Can you try completely altering your routines with him? - going back to square one as though you had just had him? It would of course take much longer but patience is always the key.

Take him for plenty of exercise and if possible don't leave him alone at all until you have very very gradually got him used to you being out of the room. Follow the advice you have already been given as to training him to get used to being left.

Do you go out to work? Can you get some time off if so? Can you not take him shopping with you? I know this will be a very long term thing because something has gone awry in the first place.

I do have a bitch who I have never been able to leave alone but I am lucky because as long as there is another with her she is ok. She won't even be crated on her own and won't tolerate being shut in her crate to eat. I have never had this problem before but it seems that it is in her genes because sevral of her decendants are the same.

I pray that this can be resolved as it sounds as though this has taken over your life!

[NerdyDogOwner]

Odd giving an update so quickly, but after I today started with my "heating" up his room and lowering the rest of the apartment, things have taken a surprising turn.

In addition to the heat, I also removed his blacket (which is situated next to me when at the computer) and a few pillows. This is because I have a wooden floor, and felt sorry for the guy not having a nice carpet. I even placed his crate in his room.

Anyways, now he is forced to go to his room if he wants to lay down on something better than a hard floor. This took 3 "lay downs" for him to figure out.

He would lay down on the floor (with a rather uncomfortable "clunk" sound) next to me. I then got up and went into his room, sat down next to his blanket and patted it while calling him over. He came over, and laid down with a sigh. Clearly more comfy than that floor!

So, like I mentioned, this happened 3 times. Now he has been going in and out of his room all the time. And spending time in there! Usually he just goes in to get a toy, or a drink. I have left the babygate open the whole time.
He even took a nap/sleep in there! WOW!

I am relived. I know this might be premature, but I feel this is a step in the right direction. A week with this, and I think I can start closing the babygate without protests.
To be on the safe side, I am going to use the crate if I have to leave or keep him restrained, and not his room. Just to remove his association of being alone in that room. I want that room to be a happy place, and it seems to be just that now.

EDIT: It's late here, and bed time. And he is sleeping in his room! I am going to see if he willingly sleeps there tonight. I am going to keep the babygate open, so he feels no pressure. Fingers crossed!

[renaultf1]

That sounds like a step in the right direction. It is always better when they make the decision to go in their crate and/or room on their own. That way they have a good association with it. I'll keep my fingers crossed that he starts accepting alone time better.

[NerdyDogOwner]

Heh, well last night was an adventure. He slept in his room…sort of. He came into my bedroom several times, but I just walked into his room and he followed and jumped into his bed/blanket. I went back to my bed, he came back in to me.

This happened up to 8 times. Eventually he didn't come back. But when I woke up this morning, I found him on the sofa...hmmmmmm. Not sure if he slept there all night or not! Sneaky little guy!

[Patty]

Hooray - it sounds as though you're making progress. That was a brainwave to make his own room more comfortable and warm than the others.

You've obviously being patient which I think, is the key. If you panic or get desperate he will sense it too.

I'm praying that all will be well soon and we'll have more progress reports.

[NerdyDogOwner]

Well I got the DAP electric diffuser thing yesterday, and have had it plugged-in in his room. Also his blanket is close to it.

It actually seems to be working. When I closed the babygate all he did was look at me for some time, but never really cried. Just a little whimper here and there. Eventually he started to play with some toys, and just lie down on his blanket.

So today I was looking forward to how he was when I leave the apartment to do some shopping, while in his room. I placed my video camera in his room, and closed the main door.
Now usually he would howl and cry nonstop. I know because I have filmed him. Also he has sore throat problems because of this.

Well, he did howl, but only for some short bursts maybe for 2-3 minutes. Other than that he just whimpered a little and sat there. Even lied down for a bit!

He did try to climb up to the window ledge, I guess he thinks it's a way out. And try to claw at the door handle….luckily the door swings inward, so I don't think he can get the door open even if he does managed to use it.

The main problem I have is coming home when he is not whimpering and howling. Sometimes I can hear him out the door. But watching the video today I saw it was a bad time to enter. So it seems his howls and cry are also enforced to the idea that that is what it takes to get me home.

SO, the nerd that I am, I ordered a wireless surveillance web-camera to put in his room. And I am going to close his door and sneak into my own bedroom with my laptop and watch him. Only when he lies down and is calm will I go over and open the door to award him.
Hopefully doing that several times will help.

I will let you know how it works out!

[Basenjimamma]

Good to hear..I sure hope things work out.
I know how frustrating it is when you try one thing after another and nothing seems to work..good luck.

[NerdyDogOwner]

Just a little update.

Things are not going well. The DAP effect wore out pretty fast. But I am still going to use them, hoping they take hold.

I have been using a webcam and watching him, giving him awards when he lies down, and is quiet.

This did seem to work, but after I had to leave the appartment for a few hours I came home to a destroyed dogbed. He had torn it apart, all stuffing was all over, and he had urinated.

4 days has passed, and now he urinates when put in the room and I leave the apartment. Even for short trips, like to the store. I had bought a new bedding, and he destroyed that one too!

I am starting to think more and more of calling the vet and start him on some drugs, but that does seem unfair since I have not really given him a long enough time to fight this.

Anyways, I am now thinking of enforcing "tough love", and just leave the apartment everyday for 3-4 hours (maybe for for a movie or something). And If he urinates, then fine. I will wash it up. My hope is he will start getting used to it….

[nkjvcjs]

Don't think of using behavioral medications as unfair.

My Katie is on prozac, and it has helped her so much that I wish I had put her on it from the beginning. She is still my wonderful, sweet, happy girl, it just helps make the panic less, and helps her recover faster when something does panic her.

Behavioral meds help when used in conjunction with training and behavioral modification. They help even out the panic a bit so that the mind is able to respond to the training.

Be sure you are working with a vet who is studied in behavior and behavioral meds, and be patient, because they can take up to 6 weeks to work.

-Nicole

[NerdyDogOwner]

Isn't there any natural medications availabul? I just don't feel comfortable giving him drugs that will damage his liver/kidneys etc…as all drugs do.
He is only 7 months after all.

I remember I came across some UK site with some "all natural" tablets, but I forgot to save it.

[Basenjimamma]

NerdyDogOwner..sometimes all beds are torn up, no matter how happy or sad the dog is..some dogs are just like that, don't buy a new one just yet, he can sleep on his messed up bed, giving him a new one with fresh stuffing might just feed his desire to tear it up..bored or not.
Yes, tough love might work, just be very matter of fact, no fussing about going out, nor coming back, don't give in to his excitement when you return, just greet him in a calm manner and if cleaning is to be done, do that, no scolding or anything like that. We have tried various things for Otis, but he simply hates being crated, he bites his cratebars, so they look like 8's now instead of straight bars going up and down..I still put him in their and eventually he falls asleep. I also have three more dogs so he has company when looked up, him in one crate, Moses, the podengo in his own crate and our two smaller older ones are loose in the same room…
Yesterday we were crating them up to leave and go look at a new house and Otis refused to go in, and jumped up on our bed and let out this awesome yodel..his first one ever, I laughed and laughed at him, his tail was wiggling and he ran into his crate no problems after that..but he spoke his mind..
Good luck..