You aren’t walking him far enough. He will go if you extend your walk. Also keep a treat in your pocket to reward him after he goes.
Menopause vs Basenjis - PLEASE READ my story! This is very important!
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Just for interest sake, I ran the scenario by my niece, who is a vet. She knew about the connection…...and would have nailed it. Nice to know she is on top of things like this.
GOOD FOR HER!!! Wish she'd been my vet!
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WOW - thanks for sharing. I wonder about people babysitting small children, does it rub off on them? I'm guessing it rubbed off on the dogs, or were they licking you?
In the articles I've read so far it CAN affect children. I'm still trying to find out if it can affect other adults….like my husband!
And, yes, it must have rubbed off on my dogs.....because they do not lick my arms. I pick Haley up twice a day to give her pills because she has Fanconi. I do not pick Prince up, but I've noticed that when I lay on the bed to pet him I am touching him with my forearms and hands. The specialty vet and articles that I've read site dogs licking the area though. That's definitely not the case with my dogs.P.S. I rarely wear anything with sleeves since I live in Mesa, Arizona.....my arms are almost always exposed!
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Did you all get a chance to look at the pics I posted earlier of Haley and Prince? Pretty dramatic, huh?!
Since I'm around them practically 24/7 I don't always consciously SEE how bad the fur loss is…..........but when I look at them in pictures, I get really upset!!!
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Topical human hormones and animals was mentioned in this
Hope I did this right.
Interesting thread, CongoMama! I doesn't say if she ever figured out her puppy's problem or what it was. Even though the post is over a year old, I still sent her a message about it. Hope I hear back from her! Thanks!
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Topical human hormones and animals was mentioned in this
Hope I did this right.
Interesting thread, CongoMama! I doesn't say if she ever figured out her puppy's problem or what it was. Even though the post is over a year old, I still sent her a message about it. Hope I hear back from her! Thanks!
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Hi Dan,
Who is Dr Dodds and the OFA? (color me BLOND! teehee)
SadieYou will get more credibility by using the OFA recommended labs than Dodds. I would contact the company and demand reimbursements for your veterinary costs. Please make them act responsibly!
What I don't get is why his testosterone would go up with your spray, which is only estrogen. High estrogen levels actually decrease testosterone. If you find out what the cause is, can you let us know.
I know estrogen can cause havoc. I use the patch and I make sure it is in a container in the trash safe from the dogs. Do not flush your patches folks–- they end up in our water as filtration, not so good at removing estrogen.
I am glad you found out though. Now they can begin to regrow their hair.
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You will get more credibility by using the OFA recommended labs than Dodds. I would contact the company and demand reimbursements for your veterinary costs. Please make them act responsibly!
I've thought about that! I did just read an article about a woman who did contact the makers. They told her to submit her $600 worth of bills to them and they would consider reimbursing her. In the end they DENIED the reimbursement. I'm not one bit surprised by that! And my bills have got to be quite a bit more than that….especially because I have TWO dogs affected! I've asked our specialty vet to put me in touch (if possible) with the other people in my area who's dogs were exposed. One of them had THREE dogs.....all greatly affected! Maybe we can do something as a group?!
What I don't get is why his testosterone would go up with your spray, which is only estrogen. High estrogen levels actually decrease testosterone. If you find out what the cause is, can you let us know.
It was not his Testosterone that was high….it was his Progesterone. I will have the vet explain the connection to me later and "report out"!
I know estrogen can cause havoc. I use the patch and I make sure it is in a container in the trash safe from the dogs. Do not flush your patches folks–- they end up in our water as filtration, not so good at removing estrogen.
Great reminder for everyone! Use great caution with these hormones….....even if we cannot SEE them they are still be there......and they are POTENT!
I am glad you found out though. Now they can begin to regrow their hair.
I cannot wait to see them with fur again!!!!
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Do you see the fur coming in at all?
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Not yet, Dan. It's only been 9 days, though. Evedently, WATCHED HAIR WON'T GROW! haha
But, what I have noticed on Haley is that she is starting to have some discharge from her swollen vulva. I'm studying all of her health issues/vet records right now, and I see that this same set of symptoms happened one time when I went away for two weeks. Obviously, she wasn't exposed to the topical Estrogen on my skin for the time I was gone and by the time I got home she was having these exact symptoms. Though the symptoms sound awful….I'm taking this as a sign that since I stopped the Evamist spray and started using the tiny patch on my belly instead, her exposure to the hormone has dropped dramatically. I'll consult the vets this week about it and see if the other Estrogen-exposed female dogs in their practice has experienced the same thing.
Toooooo much information????!!! Are you sorry you asked??!!!!!
Sadie
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Thank you so much for posting this warning.
I am acutely aware of what chemical residues can do and make upas many natural sprays as possible. I'm (thankfully) well past the Menopause and so haven't experienced this - 'll be passing on your warning to all the doggy folk
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UPDATE: It's 2 1/2 weeks after the doggies stopped being exposed to the topical Estradiol. I am definately seeing new hair growth on Prince! I think I can see a little here and there on Haley, too. I believe from the skin biopsies that her skin was in worse shape than Prince's…..and she did have 1 more year of exposure than he did. Also, I've started a blog called Our Hormone Dilemma so I can try to connect people with similar stories and help those who are in the research phase of this crazy ordeal. If you know of anyone (female OR male) using topical hormone replacements of any kind, please give them this URL: hormonedilemma.blogspot.com
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Was there some sort of warning (pamphlet) that came with the spray? If not, I would contact the the drug company/FDA. This is a serious matter. If they indicate that you can spray it on your arms, the drug company/FDA and doctors need to know you have to apply it to an area that is covered.
APPARENTLY THE FDA DOES KNOW
http://www.fda.gov/Drugs/DrugSafety/PostmarketDrugSafetyInformationforPatientsandProviders/ucm220185.htm -
ALSO: Yesterday I talked with a woman who was using a hormone replacement therapy that effected her dogs. She was using an experimental Estradiol and Progesterone cream on her forearms. Her dogs - a young male Boston Terrier and an older female Vizsla - licked her arms a lot. The male ended up with SEVERE hair loss and an extremely affected prostate gland. Most of his prostate gland and penis had to be removed and then a hole had to be created for urinating…..which caused kidney stones.....then more surgery and a new hole for urinating......and Testoterone shots...etc. etc. etc. This after only 1 to 1.5 yrs exposure to her drug. He now (a year or so later) has all his hair back, but is left incontinent, on meds, and in diapers. The owner is left $20,000 poorer.
The female Vizsla had cancer and died before the anyone connected the HRT with the dogs' symptoms.....but, before she died her vet was amazed and confused by her extremely large vulva.
This is a horrible story and I cannot stand the thought of it ever being repeated........
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Was there some sort of warning (pamphlet) that came with the spray? If not, I would contact the the drug company/FDA. This is a serious matter. If they indicate that you can spray it on your arms, the drug company/FDA and doctors need to know you have to apply it to an area that is covered.
APPARENTLY THE FDA DOES KNOW
http://www.fda.gov/Drugs/DrugSafety/PostmarketDrugSafetyInformationforPatientsandProviders/ucm220185.htmYes, the drug I was using comes with a pamphlet. I believe it now says it must be used on the forearms and after it dries the skin should be covered. I started using it 3 years ago which was a couple years before the FDA put out their warning. I remember reading all the warning information that came with it the first time I used it, but I don't remember it saying to cover the skin. I do remember it saying to let it dry before touching anything. So, I don't know if the pamphlet's warnings have changed or not over the years. I do remember questioning the doctor about it's safety to others and he assured me it was fine as long as I let it dry. I think that was the general feeling three years ago, and there wasn't any FDA warning at the time. BUT, after the FDA put out the warning over a year ago, it would've been nice to have my doctor alert his patients of it each time we go in to have our RX renewed. Unfortunately, I have learned a huge lesson that I should always read the literature that comes with each prescription EACH time it's refilled (which was every month with Evamist) and not overly rely on what the doctor tells me. Which is sad. We should be able to rely on them…..to, at least, inform us when there is a new warning from the FDA. And, truthfully, it never occured to me that I should be reading the little folded up pamphlet with tiny print every month just in case something had changed. I thought I'd learned long ago as parent that I needed to be my own and family's advocate....but, evidentaly, I didn't learn it good enough. The lesson has slapped me upside the head again!
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Oh…..one last thing......I think the doctors where I live REALLY have a responsibity to verbally tell their patients that if they use topical hormone replacements on their arms that the skin has to be covered. For goodness sakes, this is the PHOENIX area! We RARELY wear sleeves!!! AND we are menopausal!
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Sadie, how are your dogs going today? would love to see an updated photo of them. xx
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Sadie, how are your dogs going today? would love to see an updated photo of them. xx
I'd like to see updated pics too.
